Happiness expert Arthur Brooks says this is the key to happiness.
Transcript:
CONWAY GITTENS: From your vantage point, where does the intersectionality of the drive for wealth and the drive for happiness intersect?
ARTHUR BROOKS: Yeah, well, the problem is not often enough. Biology tells us. Mother nature tells us that if we get these worldly rewards, then we’re going to be happy. But it’s kind of a trick. So here’s the thing. Mother nature really only has two goals for us, which is to survive and pass on our genes. She doesn’t care if we’re happy. We want to be happy. So we think, look, if I follow these drives to be more successful as a person, then I’m going to be happier. Those drives really take the place and money and power and pleasure and and fame or the admiration of other people. And then we become frustrated. Why? because we get more, I guess, more competitive in the mating pool, I suppose. But that does not that’s not going to lead us to happiness. So I spent a lot of my time helping people understand that happiness is their business and they have to make choices that don’t always feel very natural if they’re going to get more of it.
CONWAY GITTENS: So what are those choices? Because we’re all trying to find that balance between being happy but also having wealth.
ARTHUR BROOKS: Yeah, I know for sure. And there’s nothing wrong with money. On the contrary. I mean, a big capitalist. I believe in the free enterprise system. Wealth and money, the financial resources that we have, that’s an intermediary goal. That’s something that we want on the way to getting the things that we actually want to do. In other words, it’s important to think about why do you want money? Well, because more is better wrong. Why do you want money? People need to actually answer that particular question. What do you want to do that’s good in the world?
One of the ways to think about this is to not just have a goal of having more, but but wanting less, you know, wanting less of the things that actually won’t bring real satisfaction. One of the ways that I talk about this with people is that, you know, we have this drive to buy stuff. You know, if I get that watch, if I get that suit, if I get that boat, if I get that house, then I’m finally going to be happy. You kind of know that’s not true. You know that’s not true. But there are ways that you can actually spend money. And the why of your money can, can, can take can take this form that’s better for your happiness. For example, buying experiences with people that you love, that’s reliable for bringing happiness, buying time and spending it with people that you love, giving your money to causes that you love and saving your money. All of those things actually do bring reliable happiness. Those are the ways to buy happiness.
CONWAY GITTENS: So how do we rewire ourselves? Because, you know, we all say money can’t buy you happiness. But somebody else might say, well, let me try this. I’ll have fun on the way, on the way of trying to figure it out.
ARTHUR BROOKS: Yeah, Yeah. And the truth of the matter is that people do figure that out. And the people who say money doesn’t buy happiness, they tend to have a lot of money. And you say, well, let, let me figure that one out on my own. Let me try that on my own. And you have to do that by making some errors and ideally by not having too much regret. One of the ways that I counsel people to do it who are working very hard, they get a lot of satisfaction from their work and they’re very financially successful. You you and I probably have the same friends. As a matter of fact, I have to urge them to fight their biological tendencies, to fill their house with stuff that they buy that second boat. It will not bring the satisfaction that you seek, but rather to spend the resources to have the experiences with the people that they love. You know, people they think that things are permanent and experiences are temporary, it’s exactly the reverse. Psychologically, experiences reside in your mind and heart forever. And it’s the things that kind of fade away. And I have to help people rewire themselves by making decisions. They don’t always feel natural but are always satisfying when they learn how to make them.
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